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 Kevin Flynn's White vs Black suit?


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1982program
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Posts: 67
Kevin Flynn's White vs Black suit?

on Sunday, August, 26, 2012 7:34 PM
Forgive me if this has already been discussed in another thread. What is the significance of Kevin Flynn changing from the white robe / ID disc he sports in his hideout on the grid vs the black rob / ID disc he wears when assisting Quorra to save Sam? They have touched on this change from white to black slightly in Uprising but really haven't explained the significance or need for a user / program to make this change. Any thoughts?where to buy abortion pills online an abortion pill buy abortion pills onlinei need to buy the abortion pill read here order abortion pill


 
Kat
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Posts: 2,350
RE: Kevin Flynn's White vs Black suit?

on Sunday, August, 26, 2012 7:50 PM
I saw it first as symbolic, second as practical. (I think we have had a thread like this before, but for the life of me I wouldn't be able to find it or I'd link to it.)

Symbolic: In a way, he's done with his Zen "sit and do nothing" philosophy. Something has clearly changed in him (or so it seems to me). He was willing to sit back and wait... until his kid's life was on the line, and now he's headed out to kick some ass. Not completely, of course-- not in the same way Sam's headed out to kick some ass-- but it's a definite change. Q sees it and she knows immediately what he's going to do. After all, at some point he changed from what he originally wore in-Grid (as seen in the flashbacks). At the time he goes into exile, he hasn't switched yet.

White's generally considered (in our culture) a color of purity, innocence, and peace. Black generally symbolizes darkness, badassery. It may even "get him into the mood" or help change his mindset (I know for me, if I'm in a crappy mood, or about to head into a situation where I need to be tough, my look tends to shift more goth-- it's psychological.) Or, alternately: white in Asian cultures is symbolic of mourning. If Flynn's into Zen Buddhism, he no doubt knows this. So it's entirely possible he wears white to begin with as a symbol that he's in mourning for everything he has lost/everything that has gone bad. His change to black may also mean he is no longer in mourning, as he's about to go out and do something about it for once in a very long time.

Also, almost everyone in the Grid wears black. Flynn has set himself apart, and he wears white. The change back to black may also symbolize that he's heading back into the general populace of the Grid.


Practical: Easier to get around in the shadows.



In this fic:
http://www.tron-sector.com/forums/default.aspx?a=top&id=439658 I define it in part as: Black for stealth. Black to signal a change. Black for a fight. Which pretty much sums up what I said above.where to buy abortion pills online order abortion pill buy abortion pills onlinei need to buy the abortion pill abortion pill order abortion pill

What do you want? I'm busy.


Program, please!


Chaos.... good news.
 
Kaisergrendel
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Posts: 298
RE: Kevin Flynn's White vs Black suit?

on Sunday, August, 26, 2012 10:36 PM
Kat Wrote:I saw it first as symbolic, second as practical. (I think we have had a thread like this before, but for the life of me I wouldn't be able to find it or I'd link to it.)

Symbolic: In a way, he's done with his Zen "sit and do nothing" philosophy. Something has clearly changed in him (or so it seems to me). He was willing to sit back and wait... until his kid's life was on the line, and now he's headed out to kick some ass. Not completely, of course-- not in the same way Sam's headed out to kick some ass-- but it's a definite change. Q sees it and she knows immediately what he's going to do. After all, at some point he changed from what he originally wore in-Grid (as seen in the flashbacks). At the time he goes into exile, he hasn't switched yet.

White's generally considered (in our culture) a color of purity, innocence, and peace. Black generally symbolizes darkness, badassery. It may even "get him into the mood" or help change his mindset (I know for me, if I'm in a crappy mood, or about to head into a situation where I need to be tough, my look tends to shift more goth-- it's psychological.) Or, alternately: white in Asian cultures is symbolic of mourning. If Flynn's into Zen Buddhism, he no doubt knows this. So it's entirely possible he wears white to begin with as a symbol that he's in mourning for everything he has lost/everything that has gone bad. His change to black may also mean he is no longer in mourning, as he's about to go out and do something about it for once in a very long time.

Also, almost everyone in the Grid wears black. Flynn has set himself apart, and he wears white. The change back to black may also symbolize that he's heading back into the general populace of the Grid.


Practical: Easier to get around in the shadows.



In this fic: http://www.tron-sector.com/forums/default.aspx?a=top&id=439658 I define it in part as: Black for stealth. Black to signal a change. Black for a fight. Which pretty much sums up what I said above.

From a character-driven point of view, I'm not sure Flynn himself is particularly given to such conspicuous symbolism. Heck, I don't think the writers really gave it that much thought.where to buy abortion pills online order abortion pill buy abortion pills onlinei need to buy the abortion pill abortion pill order abortion pill


 
J
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Posts: 247
RE: Kevin Flynn's White vs Black suit?

on Sunday, August, 26, 2012 11:20 PM
Flynn's a showman, at least when he was younger and dumber. Good point about white being a symbol of mourning. It fits the character; even before the coup happened, he had lost so much in the analog world. Encom's board saw him as a cross of madman and cash cow. He met, married, had a kid with, and lost Jordan in the space of about two years. Lora left for DC (ok, those two were such a classic case of "better as friends," but they would have been very good friends). Alan was trying to keep Flynn's ass grounded, but only able to do so much, especially with the board breathing down both their necks. If you're going for some reality in the scenario, then the Great Crash of 1983 took the stuffing out of the American gaming market - even a massive hit like his Tron game would have come out at the worst possible time. The Grid was the only thing that seemed to be working right, and the Iso miracle was just something so unexpected and wonderful that it would have been self-evident to him to help nurture it...but he forgot the Programs don;t think like humans.

And it all falls apart in the most horrible fashion possible. White for purity and passivity (he almost blends into his sterile surroundings), white for morning, white because he is a living ghost.

But black is the color of a Grid citizen. Black is the color of fighters, the Western color for anger, outrage, and mourning (I'm thinking of black armbands worn by anti-war protesters and peace protesters who wear black and hold prayer vigils in the park). At this point, the only things he has left - analog (Sam) and Digital (Quorra) - are in trouble, and enough is enough. where to buy abortion pills online an abortion pill buy abortion pills online

It's an entire universe in there, one we created, but it's beyond us now. Really. It's outgrown us. You know, every time you shut off your computer...do you know what you're doing? Have you ever reformatted a hard drive? Deleted old software? Destroyed an entire universe?"

-- Jet Bradley, Tron: Ghost in the Machine on why being a User isn't necessarily a good thing.
 
MCPcomputer
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Posts: 1,705
RE: Kevin Flynn's White vs Black suit?

on Monday, August, 27, 2012 9:21 PM

Maybe it's also like the Jedi Robes... White was the good side...

but maybe once Flynn got pissed off he didn't really go to the darkside...
but he was angry... and ready to show them some "Real User Power" for
the first time in a long time..where to buy abortion pills online an abortion pill buy abortion pills onlinei need to buy the abortion pill read here order abortion pill

"I want him in the games until he dies playing" -MCP
Great Tron 3 blog, with news links and artwork
http://tron3movie.blogspot.com/
 
Kat
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Posts: 2,350
RE: Kevin Flynn's White vs Black suit?

on Monday, August, 27, 2012 9:21 PM
Kaisergrendel Wrote:
From a character-driven point of view, I'm not sure Flynn himself is particularly given to such conspicuous symbolism. Heck, I don't think the writers really gave it that much thought.

Young Flynn? I'd say no. As we see him in T:L? Absolutely. Look around his house. The dude rezzed up *crystals*, for heaven's sake. He wears a mala and dresses as if he's living at a Buddhist meditation center. I'd say he's pretty big on symbolism, or he could meditate in jeans and a t-shirt or his pajamas.

If the writers hadn't thought about it, they wouldn't have bothered to put a color change in. It's possible Bridges himself thought of it-- it sounds like he did a lot of directing as far as how Flynn was portrayed-- but SOMEONE clearly thought about it.where to buy abortion pills online an abortion pill buy abortion pills online

What do you want? I'm busy.


Program, please!


Chaos.... good news.
 
Kaisergrendel
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Posts: 298
RE: Kevin Flynn's White vs Black suit?

on Tuesday, August, 28, 2012 9:26 AM
Kat Wrote:SOMEONE clearly thought about it.

I don't disagree with that, I just doubt they had as much time as we do to cook up these explanations. That's the general vibe I get from cast and crew interviews, articles and other literature. In my mind, it's a stretch to think Flynn would be all "Woe is me, I've lost all creation and family. I shall clothe myself in robes of white, and act a swami." But perhaps he would. He is after all, very very old. I just feel inclined to believe otherwise.

Of course, fanfic is purely your domain. YMMV.where to buy abortion pills online http://www.extrageek.com/template/default.aspx?an-abortion-pill buy abortion pills online


 
1982program
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Posts: 67
RE: Kevin Flynn's White vs Black suit?

on Tuesday, August, 28, 2012 10:54 PM
I wasn't aware of the Buddhist traditions and wearing white for mourning, but that is a great explanation for the change.

I was wondering if white vs black represents a difference in a program's code or primary task. Wouldn't be an issue w/ users but it seems in Legacy the more "emotional" programs (Sirens / Castor) are in white while the combat driven / security programs are in black. I've read interviews w/ Olivia Wilde where she campaigned to have a white suit (like Joan of Arc) but that was changed to black.

Of course, Uprising kind of screws up this thought because white / black seem to be interchangeable between Beck / Tron.abortion pills online abortion pill online purchase cytotec abortionwhere to buy abortion pills online an abortion pill buy abortion pills onlinepill for abortion online read order abortion pill


 
anonymouspunk89
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Posts: 182
RE: Kevin Flynn's White vs Black suit?

on Tuesday, August, 28, 2012 11:25 PM
Kat Wrote:
Kaisergrendel Wrote:
From a character-driven point of view, I'm not sure Flynn himself is particularly given to such conspicuous symbolism. Heck, I don't think the writers really gave it that much thought.

Young Flynn? I'd say no. As we see him in T:L? Absolutely. Look around his house. The dude rezzed up *crystals*, for heaven's sake. He wears a mala and dresses as if he's living at a Buddhist meditation center. I'd say he's pretty big on symbolism, or he could meditate in jeans and a t-shirt or his pajamas.

If the writers hadn't thought about it, they wouldn't have bothered to put a color change in. It's possible Bridges himself thought of it-- it sounds like he did a lot of directing as far as how Flynn was portrayed-- but SOMEONE clearly thought about it.


I think that Jeff had that idea. If I'm not mistaken, I believe he's a Buddhist (dude even meditates for at least half an hour before filming.)where to buy abortion pill ordering abortion pills to be shipped to house buy abortion pill onlinewhere to buy abortion pills online an abortion pill buy abortion pills online


 
Kat
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Posts: 2,350
RE: Kevin Flynn's White vs Black suit?

on Tuesday, August, 28, 2012 11:55 PM
Kaisergrendel Wrote:I don't disagree with that, I just doubt they had as much time as we do to cook up these explanations. That's the general vibe I get from cast and crew interviews, articles and other literature. In my mind, it's a stretch to think Flynn would be all "Woe is me, I've lost all creation and family. I shall clothe myself in robes of white, and act a swami." But perhaps he would. He is after all, very very old. I just feel inclined to believe otherwise.

Of course, fanfic is purely your domain. YMMV.

I don't imagine they spent as much time thinking about it as we do, no-- that's clear about some things because we HAVE to ask questions about them. But I also don't agree that they didn't have a reason for his change. Nor do I think it's entirely out of line to think "in character," even if that goes deeper than the writers actually did and ascribes motives they never intended. The whole film is fictional... so of course I'm going to think in the fictional realm. And perhaps that IS *because* I do fic and try to get into characters' heads, but hell, why not? It's fun to speculate. I think about serious stuff enough all day. Sometimes it's nice to get caught in a fantasy world. If we're going to be practical about it-- for all we know the white one was dirty and they said "what the hell, let's switch him to black, then."



1982program Wrote:I wasn't aware of the Buddhist traditions and wearing white for mourning, but that is a great explanation for the change.

I was wondering if white vs black represents a difference in a program's code or primary task. Wouldn't be an issue w/ users but it seems in Legacy the more "emotional" programs (Sirens / Castor) are in white while the combat driven / security programs are in black. I've read interviews w/ Olivia Wilde where she campaigned to have a white suit (like Joan of Arc) but that was changed to black.

Of course, Uprising kind of screws up this thought because white / black seem to be interchangeable between Beck / Tron.

I never figured out the difference. How would Zustor and the Sirens be related? How would they be different from every other program on the Grid? The only thing I can guess is that the white was simply because the directors/costumers/whoever wanted them to stick out as different.

Or, if you like-- someone noted that Flynn's white blends in with his house. The armory and EOL Club are also white, so perhaps Zustor and Sirens are meant to blend in with their environments (doubtful, but you never know). I just chalk it up to another one of those things that seems like they probably had a reason for doing X and it made sense in their heads, but unfortunately, they forgot to clue US in on the reasoning. As I've said before in other threads, it happens a lot in this film.
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What do you want? I'm busy.


Program, please!


Chaos.... good news.
 
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