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88MPH
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Posts: 8
Sequel style

on Thursday, October, 02, 2003 1:33 AM
Hey all !

I was wondering, and sorry if this has been said or asked before, what people would want to see in a Tron sequel, "style" wise.

1. Live action with CGI ?
2. All CGI ?
3. Animated in a cool Japanese way ?

The most expensive choice is number 1 of course, and probably the best too, but I can't shake the idea that today's animation is simply fantastic and could be targeted at a much older audience. either be in CGI or Animated.

I for one would go the route of cell animation combinedwith CGI, very cost effective and you make it for a mature audience.

I too am very worried that a hollywood made sequel may tend to be "dumbed" down, or have too many execs input, suffer too many screenings alerations. These things occur because producers want to make sure their 60 milion investment will recoup. However a 8 milion animated with cgi movie would suffer less from hollywood influence and be very creative.

Am I crazy ? Or just plain wrong on this ?

Comments welcomed

-S


 
IMAGinES
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Posts: 126
Re: Sequel style

on Thursday, October, 02, 2003 6:05 AM
Hmm. Your points are good, 88MPH, but I think a live-action real world makes a better contrast with a combination or total-CGI Electronic World. When the whole movie isn't "real", you lose that feeling of *difference*.

The real world sequences wouldn't need any obvious VFX, which ought to take the costs down a bit. The original movie wasn't using A-list actors (I don't think Jeff, although a good actor, was on the A-list at the time), so there's no reason to blow your budget on any this time around. (Assuming he gets brought back on board, is Jeff on the A-list nowadays?)

Fingers crossed, Disney might keep "executive input" out. They've had a whole bunch of CGI-based hits lately, so maybe they'd be more wilign to take a risk on something that mixes it up; it'd be a "fresh" approach.

These be my comments! :-)

Fortune Favour You,

IMAGinES
 
Compucore
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Posts: 4,419
Re: Sequel style

on Thursday, October, 02, 2003 10:17 AM
I'm kind of flexible in this myself. It would be either 2 and 3 if possible without blowing the pcolet book. Or seeing if its feesible in combination depending where you want to go on certain things. Again without blowing the budget. But the 2 and 3 sounds good.




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Compucore

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KiaPurity
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Posts: 3,482
Re: Sequel style

on Thursday, October, 02, 2003 11:46 AM
Yeah, Jeff's in Seabiscuit which I hear is doing pretty dang well! That's just awesome.

I'd go for CGI with liveaction... to be true to the spirit of the first movie. The CGI will be much more improved than back then, but it'll still be sweet!

Anime-style would just drive me up the wall. ^^; It'd be too weird to see anime-style Tron world... (even though I draw anime-style, doh!)



Kia: Cool. I'm a infamous mythological perfect User.

 
Speeder
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Posts: 295
Re: Sequel style

on Thursday, October, 02, 2003 11:55 AM
What ever happens in the sequel they will never capture the magic of the original!

Rincewind thought about this and then, with an air of finality, started to take off his last sock.
"No half-bricks," he said to no-one in particular. "Have to use sand?"
"You're going to attack them with a sockful of sand?"
"No, I'm going to run away from them. The sockful of sand is for when they follow.

Sourcery by Terry Pratchett


 
Compucore
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Posts: 4,419
Re: Sequel style

on Thursday, October, 02, 2003 1:38 PM
I hate to disagree with you on this Speeder.(Just putting my spin on things. And we can agree to disagree about things as well. We're all in the same group here.) I think they can capture the sweetness of what the original has from way back then. Along with the improvements of the CGI that is out there today. The only thing that I ask from them if they do sequels or update something on the original. Just don't dumb it down leave it as it is. The only thing you can do is improve on it. Add on somethings that wasn't there in the original release of the movie. Make a directors cut version of what the movie is suppose to be. Even if they could add on those two delete scenes that were taken out from the original.

I don't know if anyone remembers from the 20th anniversary edition the two deleted scenes that I am refering too from the film.



Speeder Wrote:What ever happens in the sequel they will never capture the magic of the original!


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Compucore

VROOOOOOOOOMMMM!!!

To compute or not to compute that is the question at hand. Tis nobler to compile in C++ or in TASM.


 
Speeder
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Posts: 295
Re: Sequel style

on Thursday, October, 02, 2003 2:29 PM
But how I see it , is that Tron is a one off, any improvements to CG will change the way the Tron world looks.

Also the world around us has changed to much, like computers have moved on to far for Tron to work.

And lastly I can't see another story with the same brilliance as the original ever being created without copying or completely changing the plot.

And we all saw what happened with sequal to the matrix. It was good,but when compared with the original, it was lacking in something, and that was originallity.

Sorry compucore but I can't agree with you in that department!!



Rincewind thought about this and then, with an air of finality, started to take off his last sock.
"No half-bricks," he said to no-one in particular. "Have to use sand?"
"You're going to attack them with a sockful of sand?"
"No, I'm going to run away from them. The sockful of sand is for when they follow.

Sourcery by Terry Pratchett


 
SiddyTron
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Posts: 34
Re: Sequel style

on Thursday, October, 02, 2003 6:57 PM
Actually I don't believe it will hinder the original look of the film at all. Look at Tron 2.0. It remained pretty faithful. My bro, who saw the original Tron when it came out, is not big on video or pc games. He was over the other night and when he saw Tron 2.0, he was totally blown away and the first thing he said was "Wow, they really captured the look of the film..".

However I have to say that the only way to make the sequel would be to mix cgi with live action. IMO, any other format would completely cheapen the original. CGI films are so mainstream now. Tron was a groundbreaking film. And there really hasn't been a film yet where a live action character has been totally immersed in a CGI world. I think with the proper planning, the sequel could be just as groundbreaking as the original.

"I'm the operator with my pocket calculator..." --Kraftwerk, 1981
 
Compucore
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Posts: 4,419
Re: Sequel style

on Thursday, October, 02, 2003 11:35 PM
Speeder thats why I had said that its okay that we can agree to disagree on this we all have our own interpretations of it. I'm not saying that your wrong and I'm right or that I am wrong and yor right. Just that we both have different meanings for it. Just so that we're on the right track on that part. And by the way I didn't even see the Matrix reloaded. Haven't had the chance to rent or buy DVD lately been too busy with the studies and looking for a place to do my apprenticeship over here.

And yes I do agree with you that computers have changed a lot since tron Inception. I've been through it as a technician and seen the many changes that have occured in the technology.

Well we all know the original tron movie was made very welll I'm not disagreeing with you on that. But it would have been nice to have seen a directors cut with the two missing scenes that were taken out as well. Ya still can have the original the way it was made. And/Or another with what was missing or shoud have been left in. Heck I have terminator 2 Judgment day the dvd edition. and it has two versions of the movie. A directors cut and the way it was made originally for the big screen. I've seen both of them. And I like both editions of it. I believe even Lisburger or ellenshaw had said now correct me if I'm wrong that could have left those two scenes that were left on the cutting room floor. Do you remember that..



Speeder Wrote:But how I see it , is that Tron is a one off, any improvements to CG will change the way the Tron world looks.

Also the world around us has changed to much, like computers have moved on to far for Tron to work.

And lastly I can't see another story with the same brilliance as the original ever being created without copying or completely changing the plot.

And we all saw what happened with sequal to the matrix. It was good,but when compared with the original, it was lacking in something, and that was originallity.

Sorry compucore but I can't agree with you in that department!!



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Compucore

VROOOOOOOOOMMMM!!!

To compute or not to compute that is the question at hand. Tis nobler to compile in C++ or in TASM.


 
Speeder
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Posts: 295
Re: Sequel style

on Friday, October, 03, 2003 2:34 PM
I know and I don't think we will ever agree, apart from the idea of a directors cut Tron DVD, nobody could bash that!!!



Rincewind thought about this and then, with an air of finality, started to take off his last sock.
"No half-bricks," he said to no-one in particular. "Have to use sand?"
"You're going to attack them with a sockful of sand?"
"No, I'm going to run away from them. The sockful of sand is for when they follow.

Sourcery by Terry Pratchett


 
Sketch
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Posts: 2,934
Re: Sequel style

on Friday, October, 03, 2003 4:57 PM
Personally I think total CGI would be perfect for Tron mainly because that way you have total artistic control over how the film looks and can be presented. You won't be restrainded by the limitations of cameras, sets, actors, or reality. It would be very appropriate for the film since the original made the first major attempt to use CGI. I think the film deserves the digital treatment. I mean with CGI you can fully immerse the audience in visuals and create your own world. Disney does so well putting both the artisitc and story elements into their films. They cold do this, I know it. This could be another big leap in animation for them.

I say this because every big budget CGI/Live action film I have seen in theaters I've always heard the blasted "That scene looks so fake!" I get tired of hearing that. But, I have noticed with total CGI films you don't really get that since there's no real elements in the film to compare the CGI too. I hope that made sense.

EDIT: Also... CGI would allow the original cast the opportunity to be their original characters. Like in 2.0 they can lend their voice to Disney. As a fan, it would be very hard to see other peole playing Tron, Yori, Flynn, Ram or Sark.


 
Compucore
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Posts: 4,419
Re: Sequel style

on Friday, October, 03, 2003 7:12 PM
I'll agree with you on that part there Sketch. I've done a little bit of beinf a editor, soundman, Lighting, story writer and everything in between for a shoet 10 minute film. .




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Compucore

VROOOOOOOOOMMMM!!!

To compute or not to compute that is the question at hand. Tis nobler to compile in C++ or in TASM.


 
KiaPurity
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Posts: 3,482
Re: Sequel style

on Friday, October, 03, 2003 9:38 PM
Problem with total CGI?

It'd need a HUGE budget. Squaresoft nearly went bankrupt with FF:TSW (no thanks to the losers who said, "Oh, it sucks! I won't see it!" ><; Aaaah!!!)

CGI/Live action seems cheaper that way, IMO. =/

Kia: Cool. I'm a infamous mythological perfect User.

 
88MPH
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Posts: 8
Re: Sequel style

on Saturday, October, 04, 2003 12:09 AM
Well there is a movie in the works right now where the actors are 100% submerged in CGI. No backgrounds, not sets, nothing.

It's called the Polar Express with Tom Hanks. So this one is sure to be visually interesting.

I would go with CGI combined with Live myself. Although I would love a regular Tron mini-movie, tv-movie or anime-style animation from time to time. The Tronverse is huge and we've only seen the begining.

I'm just the comic book guy and we'll do out best to create the best we can for sure. I don't know anything about a sequel, and if it's even going to happen, but one thing for sure, by the time it gets out, computer FX will be so amazing Tron will amaze people for another 20 years.

-S




 
Prankster bit
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Posts: 0
Re: Sequel style

on Tuesday, April, 13, 2004 12:52 PM
I would be interested to see what an anime/manga style tron would look like, if it was made by the same guy who gave the world "GHOST IN THE SHELL" I think it would be done really well. besides, most of those manga cartoons are set in a technology-dominated world, they should be brought one step closer by sending the [slightly violent] pointy-chin wonders into a computer

I go with number 3...

words of wisdom from...

PranKsTeR BiT V2.0



 
IsoLine
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Posts: 1,025
Re: Sequel style

on Wednesday, May, 05, 2004 2:05 AM
I would go with option 1 for the movie. Just to stay true to the orignal format with live actors and CGI elements and backgrounds. I would probably keep them looking somewhat "eclectic" like the original. The way they did it for 2.0 worked well too, don't want the CGI to look too polished because the world inside the computer doesn't have to be photorealistic and I wouldn't want destroy the altered reality of the established mise en scene. What I do think would be great would be to have a direct to video supplement done completely with regular (but decent) cel animation or anime style animation much like with the Animatrix or the Clone Wars animated specials. Better yet the supplement could even be all CGI, comprised of several stories, and each done by a specific CGI animation house. Pixar could do a short, then Eden FX, maybe Square and perhaps Zoic and even Mainframe. I think it would be pretty cool anyway.

"Word to the Motherboard!" - IsoLine
 
flynn1978
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Posts: 1,009
Re: Sequel style

on Wednesday, May, 05, 2004 11:37 AM
IMAGinES Wrote:Hmm. Your points are good, 88MPH, but I think a live-action real world makes a better contrast with a combination or total-CGI Electronic World. When the whole movie isn't "real", you lose that feeling of *difference*.

The real world sequences wouldn't need any obvious VFX, which ought to take the costs down a bit. The original movie wasn't using A-list actors (I don't think Jeff, although a good actor, was on the A-list at the time), so there's no reason to blow your budget on any this time around. (Assuming he gets brought back on board, is Jeff on the A-list nowadays?)

Fingers crossed, Disney might keep "executive input" out. They've had a whole bunch of CGI-based hits lately, so maybe they'd be more wilign to take a risk on something that mixes it up; it'd be a "fresh" approach.

These be my comments! :-)

Kia's right and your comment's very good! It wouldn't be the same if we saw a "digital" representation and not Mr. Bridges in the ACTUAL FILM! SAME FOR THE REST!

Sketch Wrote:Personally I think total CGI would be perfect for Tron mainly because that way you have total artistic control over how the film looks and can be presented. You won't be restrainded by the limitations of cameras, sets, actors, or reality. It would be very appropriate for the film since the original made the first major attempt to use CGI. I think the film deserves the digital treatment. I mean with CGI you can fully immerse the audience in visuals and create your own world. Disney does so well putting both the artisitc and story elements into their films. They cold do this, I know it. This could be another big leap in animation for them.

I say this because every big budget CGI/Live action film I have seen in theaters I've always heard the blasted "That scene looks so fake!" I get tired of hearing that. But, I have noticed with total CGI films you don't really get that since there's no real elements in the film to compare the CGI too. I hope that made sense.

EDIT: Also... CGI would allow the original cast the opportunity to be their original characters. Like in 2.0 they can lend their voice to Disney. As a fan, it would be very hard to see other peole playing Tron, Yori, Flynn, Ram or Sark.


I have to think there should not be total CGI. There could be some great motion capture tatics taken like Gollum and applied to some of the programs. This wouldn't be hard to gel, due to the fact that Final Fantasy the Spirits within had such a close line to looking real-and there's been a nice span of time since that was made.

It is not a real problem to combine the actors and the digital ones...with that push to combine them, there just might be some new ideas developed on how to combine them that would expand and enrich the electronic world!

I want the new film to echo the original-with actual people in it.

"Well programs will be thinking soon..."

"He he ha ha...won't that be grand? The computers and the programs will start thinking and the people will stop."



"Happy is the man of reason who can face the world in season."


 
DaveTRON
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Posts: 5,304
Re: Sequel style

on Wednesday, May, 05, 2004 12:28 PM
Wouldn't live real world and CGI TRON world scenes make sense?

DaveTRON
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Compucore
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Posts: 4,419
Re: Sequel style

on Wednesday, May, 05, 2004 2:04 PM
I would agree with you on this Davetron. Like the original Movie of Tron. Where you have it half and half. I know that the original Tron Movie had something like only30 minutes or so of CGI for the film. But I think Like yourself that there should be both CGI and real world combined for the sequal.


DaveTRON Wrote:Wouldn't live real world and CGI TRON world scenes make sense?


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Compucore

VROOOOOOOOOMMMM!!!

To compute or not to compute that is the question at hand. Tis nobler to compile in C++ or in TASM.


 
Traahn
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Posts: 3,188
Re: Sequel style

on Tuesday, June, 01, 2004 1:08 AM
To keep it true to the original, I'd appreciate it if it had:

* A short amount of time spent in the real world with real locations and real actors, then the remainder of the film being pretty much in the computer. But while in the computer, I hope it has the real live actors in there like the original movie.


I'm getting out of here right now, and you guys are invited. ------^
 
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