I know a few of us have the idea that Flynn transferred TRON from the Grid (as he said "I brought TRON over from the old system"). But, after recalling my youth, and when it comes to computers in general, technically, TRON came over into the new system, but never really left the old one. I'm not sure if anyone is familiar with computer programs, but the TRON we saw in T:L may not be the same TRON from the first film. I mean that when it comes to software, you can copy files over onto a disk and then copy them over onto another computer (utilizing the old network type called "Sneakernet". The thing about computer programs, especially at that time, was that when you transfered files, you really were just transferring copies to the medium used for transport while the original program and/or files remain on the original source computer (unless otherwise deleted by the users).

In short hand: basically, the TRON we saw in the first film remained on the Encom server and continued to do his job while an identical copy was installed on Flynn's Grid. That means that up until the company switched over into the newer servers from the old Encom 511, TRON was still with Yori on the Game Grid, while the TRON we saw in Flynn's Grid is a newly installed one that probably doesn't even know of Yori or the events with the MCP.

I know, it sounds strange, but people forget that TRON, YORI and CLU are all programs within a computer system. And when you begin to apply facts about software and computers, you begin to see things in a whole new light.order abortion pill morning after pill price where to buy abortion pill

Yep.

However in all likelihood, the original Tron should have been deleted and shelved and many new security programs written from the ground up (as opposed to based on Tron's design) to replace him. The original Tron probably isn't operational at all.

I would have a hard time believing Tron still exists at Encom in any recognizable form. 28 years is a long time to avoid obsoletion. He's over a thousand years old in computer years.

Pilgrim1099 Wrote:EDIT: I also want to add that if Sam ever installs the memory card into the ENCOM system in order to salvage the Grid and find his father again, that means we would have TWO Trons running around. The one from the Grid as "Rinzler" will immigrate to ENCOM's system and so will other programs. But the ENCOM world will be far more advanced than Kevin's server.

That is unless the original TRON is still installed in the same place, resulting in an the old TRON being overwritten by Flynn's Grid TRON. But then again, it could very well be that TRON was replaced by newer programs and put into retirement on the Encom servers and that the Flynn's Grid TRON would be a clean install.abortion pills online http://www.kvicksundscupen.se/template/default.aspx?abortion-questions cytotec abortion

Kaisergrendel Wrote:Possible, but if so he would need to have written it relatively recently for New Tron to last to the current date. Regardless, this in itself excludes any hope of the original Tron being found on a modern Encom system.

Unless Alan was smart enough to backup the last of the latest copy of the program (with any updates he made to it along the way). Seriously, that's what backups are for.

Kaisergrendel Wrote:As I said before, it's unrealistic to expect a program to last nearly 3 decades by simply upgrading it over time. Eventually it becomes counter-productive to work on backward compatibility in every iteration of an OS - they'll need to start over to make way for true progress.

Of course, it's possible that TRON is still in the newer system, just stored in an archive bin and completely off-line (let's face it, a company like Encom wouldn't just delete TRON, a program that practically brought an end to the MCP's reign of tyranny. They'd keep his program saved because it is a major part of not just Encom's history, but in the history of security programs in the film's universe. He was basically the first version of any kind of security program that existed and other security programs came to be as a result of him). For all we know, Encom TRON is probably resting comfortable inside a .zip file in a folder marked "Important Historical Files of Encom".on line abortion pill misoprostol dose abortion medical abortion pill online

Yes that makes sense. It would also explain why the new Tron moves so fast and looks different. Rinzler is just more advanced.

But yes Even Flynn advanced after all these years and really changed the way he
looked and gained more user power.

What I don't understand is is if the MCP is going to return.
or if dillinger senior is going to be the next MCP.

I really hope they make Tron 3 and I hope it's a great movie.

Mayorcan Wrote:OK, just so I'm clear with what everybody else is saying (this thread kind of confused me): 1) The Tron in Flynn's Grid is a copied program. Flynn "brought" Tron to his Grid by copying the one we saw in the first film and giving him some upgrades (i.e. greater memory allocation per Tron Files in Tron Evolution game).

Yes.

2) The Grid Tron has all the memories of the Encom Tron, but he is still a copy, albeit an upgraded one.

Possibly on this (as there is no evidence to suggest that he does or doesn't remember the events on the Encom server, as we never have any indications in the film or the comic. I don't know about the game, but there's an indication in the upcoming TRON: Uprising that he and every other program knows of him).

3) The original Tron *should* have continued running on the Encom server with Yori, Dumont, and the rest. Their fates post-1982 are unknown. However, it can be certain that Encom Tron does not have the memories of experiences in Kevin Flynn's Grid, since he's never been there.

Yes.

Maybe that last point can be a new plot point. Maybe inside the world of the computer, programs that are copied have some kind of "telepathic link" to their copies, akin to strange human phenomena like deja vu. Perhaps Encom Tron is somehow aware of the fate of his "brother", and it may help Sam and Quorra find Rinzler-Tron in the next movie.

Or the TRON from Flynn's Grid is still corrupted from the head hit from CLU's coup, though he has some memories of who he is, causing some major problems on the Encom servers, and the only other program capable of stopping him is the TRON in the archive.order abortion pill abortion pill buy online where to buy abortion pillwhere to buy abortion pill ordering abortion pills to be shipped to house buy abortion pill online

RenegadeProgram Wrote:I agree to a point. . .I have a feeling that after Richard Mackie and Ed Jr. took over that they may have demoted TRON 1.0 to lesser functions, especially seeing the crappy way that they treated Alan in that boardroom scene. Anyhoo, ENCOM TRON, in my opinion, may not even know what his "twin" (GRID TRON) has been up to, unless Flynn had programmed some special kind of link in TRON 1.0's coding. I guess we'll have to wait until TR3N comes out to find out. In regards to Yori, I have a feeling that Dr. Baines may have taken her to D.C. when she got that job with that firm in D.C. and left ENCOM.

There's also the possibility that after the incident in the first film, Flynn told Lora about what happened and then she took Yori out to prevent Flynn from continuing his experiments, thus leading to the digitization lab to be closed down. However, he somehow managed to make the digitization process to work without Yori, and she's currently in cold storage. This would account for why Lora and Alan hadn't considered that Flynn was trapped on his Grid for 20+ years, because they not only didn't know he had set up a second Grid, but that they didn't know he had the ability to digitize himself without the use of Yori. And since Sam found out about his father's Grid, they're going to end up re-installing Yori in order for her to work on how to put Kevin Flynn back together and bring the laser back to Encom and open up a new digitization lab.

CB2001 Wrote: Pilgrim1099 Wrote:EDIT: I also want to add that if Sam ever installs the memory card into the ENCOM system in order to salvage the Grid and find his father again, that means we would have TWO Trons running around. The one from the Grid as "Rinzler" will immigrate to ENCOM's system and so will other programs. But the ENCOM world will be far more advanced than Kevin's server. That is unless the original TRON is still installed in the same place, resulting in an the old TRON being overwritten by Flynn's Grid TRON. But then again, it could very well be that TRON was replaced by newer programs and put into retirement on the Encom servers and that the Flynn's Grid TRON would be a clean install.

I'm sure the ENCOM Tron is still in there, probably as a high level admin program this time around. And if "Rinzler" were to migrate into the ENCOM server by way of the memory card, Tron would absorb him or 'write' over him. He might even be angry at first for Kevin copying him and causing the corruption indirectly by way of CLU, even though he may agree to help Sam find Flynn's pieces (if the writers go that way which I suspect).

The writers need to be VERY careful because that would be bringing in many characters into the story and create an unfocused story structure. They would have no choice but to split the story for part 3 and 4, if they need to pace it out. The last thing they want to do is pull a "Spiderman 3" with too many characters involved.order abortion pill http://unclejohnsprojects.com/template/default.aspx?morning-after-pill-price where to buy abortion pill

CB2001 Wrote: RenegadeProgram Wrote:I agree to a point. . .I have a feeling that after Richard Mackie and Ed Jr. took over that they may have demoted TRON 1.0 to lesser functions, especially seeing the crappy way that they treated Alan in that boardroom scene. Anyhoo, ENCOM TRON, in my opinion, may not even know what his "twin" (GRID TRON) has been up to, unless Flynn had programmed some special kind of link in TRON 1.0's coding. I guess we'll have to wait until TR3N comes out to find out. In regards to Yori, I have a feeling that Dr. Baines may have taken her to D.C. when she got that job with that firm in D.C. and left ENCOM. There's also the possibility that after the incident in the first film, Flynn told Lora about what happened and then she took Yori out to prevent Flynn from continuing his experiments, thus leading to the digitization lab to be closed down. However, he somehow managed to make the digitization process to work without Yori, and she's currently in cold storage. This would account for why Lora and Alan hadn't considered that Flynn was trapped on his Grid for 20+ years, because they not only didn't know he had set up a second Grid, but that they didn't know he had the ability to digitize himself without the use of Yori. And since Sam found out about his father's Grid, they're going to end up re-installing Yori in order for her to work on how to put Kevin Flynn back together and bring the laser back to Encom and open up a new digitization lab.

To bring Yori back, they need Lora Baines to do that. OR Sam could hack into the government files and steal the Yori program, but I doubt he would do that to his father's old girlfriend.

The ONLY way to find Flynn's pieces is to track his digital DNA and the ONLY person/program who shares that is the one who said:

"I'm NOT your father, Sam, but I'm vewwy, vewwy happy to see you".

Sam would have to reconstruct CLU 3.0 as a 'digital bloodhound' since he has similar DNA qualities his father had. OR create a program after himself unless he finds a way to master his User-like powers to track him down. Those are the THREE best possibilities. Anything else would not make sense. If I were the writers, reviving CLU into version 3.0 is the right thing to do, even though it won't be that easy to pull it off story-wise to make it believable. I'm sure there are ways to do it as a hidden kernel trick that stores history back-tracking, not to different than Photoshop's Brush History tool.

All Sammy needs is his father's handbook on CLU's line of code. He can't just make it up out of his head. It had to be written down, saved and used for reference in case he needs to tweak it more, or if the program is derezzed. I remember copying lines of machine language code from the Commodore RUN magazine back in the 1980s, so I know that one has to use some paper reference or hard copy of the program in order to replicate it.

EDIT: And besides CLU is more like a detective program, to me. Catching clues. Get it? . So, CLU and Rinzler could open up their own Detective Agency practice while Tron does his thing. From now on, he can refer him to as "Mr. Rinzler, we got us a case to solve! The Case of the Burping MCP!"order abortion pill morning after pill price where to buy abortion pill

CB2001 Wrote: Pilgrim1099 Wrote:To bring Yori back, they need Lora Baines to do that. OR Sam could hack into the government files and steal the Yori program, but I doubt he would do that to his father's old girlfriend. You mean doubt Sam would got to Lora Bradley, his CEO's wife, his second mother figure and family friend, and also the only other digitization expert left alive? I don't see how that's not possible. The ONLY way to find Flynn's pieces is to track his digital DNA and the ONLY person/program who shares that is the one who said: "I'm NOT your father, Sam, but I'm vewwy, vewwy happy to see you". Sam would have to reconstruct CLU 3.0 as a 'digital bloodhound' since he has similar DNA qualities his father had. OR create a program after himself unless he finds a way to master his User-like powers to track him down. Those are the THREE best possibilities. Anything else would not make sense. If I were the writers, reviving CLU into version 3.0 is the right thing to do, even though it won't be that easy to pull it off story-wise to make it believable. I'm sure there are ways to do it as a hidden kernel trick that stores history back-tracking, not to different than Photoshop's Brush History tool. All Sammy needs is his father's handbook on CLU's line of code. He can't just make it up out of his head. It had to be written down, saved and used for reference in case he needs to tweak it more, or if the program is derezzed. I remember copying lines of machine language code from the Commodore RUN magazine back in the 1980s, so I know that one has to use some paper reference or hard copy of the program in order to replicate it. EDIT: And besides CLU is more like a detective program, to me. Catching clues. Get it? . So, CLU and Rinzler could open up their own Detective Agency practice while Tron does his thing. From now on, he can refer him to as "Mr. Rinzler, we got us a case to solve! The Case of the Burping MCP!" Or so you say. We don't really know if digital DNA is required to find the pieces of Flynn, let alone if CLU is needed. For all we know, Flynn temporarily using Quorra's ID disc may have left a trace of his digital DNA and that disc got thrown away from the platform in the blast, thus landing in the Sea of Simulation below, and TRON may have recovered it. Or, something like with what happened to Lora in the TRON 2.0 video game happened to Flynn, there may be a "ghost" left behind in the machine (I also refer to the TRON 2.0 comic Ghost in the Machine, which involved a program that was a duplicate copy of Jet Bradley) due to the fact that Sam may have loaded a backup copy and since the real Kevin Flynn is gone, the system compensates by creating a purely digital copy of him.

Well, even if he does find and track down Dr. Lora Bradley, the estranged wife of Alan, how would he explain Quorra to her? Or explain his father's situation? I think it's a question of how much time and development they can focus on her character in the script to move the story to make it happen. OR would it make sense for Sam to try his hand in finding his father?

After all, the Shiva laser is STILL sitting in the arcade basement. I would'nt be surprised if he smuggles it out into his own garage home or moved to somewhere a bit more secure in a new house, perhaps with an underground lab all to himself.

I think if we can 'back track' our moves on the desktop, similar to Apple's Time Machine, I don't see how Sam cannot go back inside the Grid and reverse time in several steps before his father got re-integrated with CLU? We have the UNDO command on Adobe Photoshop, Illustrator and such which I use as a valuable tool, even the Brush History allows me to 'Step Backward'.

As a User, he should be able to 'warp' the Grid back a few steps but he would have to change 'history' by preventing his father's deresolution and re-write CLU to deal with the new situation at ENCOM and The Dillingers.

I know it sounds very 'Deux Ex Machina' to solve the Flynn problem quickly without any hard work, then again the cliche works well because Users are really performing 'deux ex machina' acts. Look what Flynn did to the Solar Sailor in the first film. Very 'Deux Ex', no?


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